Either fling or friend – never girlfriend

[lost_hope]

Hi all,

Although there are similar topics here, such as nonreciprocal relationships, I still wanted to open this topic because it’s sort of a specific one.

The thing is that throughout my (unsuccessful) years of trying to find “the one” – or at least someone – there has been a clear pattern. It’s one of two scenarios: 1) I’m friends with a guy and I have a crush but he does not, and we just end up as friends, 2) I have a fling (at one point there were quite a few), and I would like to continue it and maybe I’m a bit interested, but he’s not, end of story.

So the essence is that I always end up to be either a friend or a fling, but I never seem to cause any romantic feelings in a guy.

I do think that part of the reason I end up as a friend is because I grew up with two older brothers and I’m sort of used to the whole guy-thing. And I guess I have some so-called “male characteristics” in that I enjoy critcal conversation and I am not afraid to have an opinion. I would also say that I’m self-confident, and I can keep up with most of the guys when it comes to drinking ;)

My theory is that guys feel intimidated by me, so the girlfriend-thing is not really an option, but seemingly they still think I’m hot enough for a one-night stand.

The thing is that I have no idea how to change that! How do I always give the vibes “don’t be my boyfriend, just sleep with me”, even though that’s not what I want!? It’s definitely not intentional!

I’m thinking about this right now because had a perfect date with a guy, and I was definitely smitten, and again I got the feeling that he just wants something physical. And now I catch myself thinking about what I should have done differently. (Although there hasn’t even been a second date…)

Does anyone else here have similar issues?

[Angel88]

I don’t exactly have the same issue, but I can relate.
I hope you don’t mind my saying what I kind of read from your comment. When you say “men are intimidated by me”, I see something else. Could it be you’re really just hiding? I have met many women who are accomplished, opinionated, attractive, and very smart who hide behind all of that. Deep down, they’re afraid to be really vulnerable, really flawed, and vocal about what they truly want for fear to be like “those women” who are weak and not this or that. At one point I was like that. I still am. I’m terrified of being flawed and vulnerable. The intimidating thing? Yeah, I’ve heard that before from some men. But I realize it’s just what I project because my armor has always been being smart, and assertive academically and professionally, not because that’s all I am or I genuinely feel that way all the time, but because it keeps me from being abused the way I was as a kid.
Being the so called cool girl is great if it truly is your core, but I have the feeling it might just be an aspect of yourself and not the whole picture.
I don’t mean any disrespect and forgive me if it sounds condescending. I honestly don’t mean it this way.

I just saw myself a few years back in your description.
What happens if you don’t play the drinking game? What happens if you one day just decide to listen to the dude and observe him without giving your opinion?
What kind of man would honestly be a good match for you?
I think many of those men who don’t want to be serious with you are simply not a great match for you. Don’t give them too much credit.
Remember as well that finding a deeper connection is rare. Keep that in mind so you keep your head up even when disappointment strikes.

[lost_hope]

Dear Angel 88,

Thank you for your thoughts. And it did not sound condescending at all!

I think there might be some trouth to your observation. I do have difficulties telling guys what I really want and showing vulnerability – I blame my experiences.

But it’s definitely not the whole picture. I enjoy few things as much as stimulating intellectual conversation, I love getting to the core of things! And I do enjoy going out and having a few drinks and just having fun.
So I would say that I’m just always doing being myself (at least most of the time).

The thing is that I don’t want want to not be myself, but I do have this feeling that it’s just never going to work, that no-one is ever going to fall in love with me.

The irony is that other than romantic relationships, I never have trouble finding friends, so I don’t seem to be completely terrible :D

[Angel88]

Of course you’re not terrible. Be kind to yourself. Many of us have issues in the romantic area.
I can relate to the fear and sadness and thought that it’s never going to happen for us. It’s a constant for me too. But I have also learned that although flawed, I’m not terrible. I’m just not for everyone :)

It’s definitely never about being something you’re not. We don’t even realize when we’re being something we’re not and that’s a pickle. Awareness is difficult at times. I thought I was being myself in the past, but in hindsight I know I wasn’t and it was because I didn’t even know who I was in the first place!!! I definitely thought I did though.
You can always dig deeper into yourself. Introspection is great. Just as much as we try to get to know other people, we can try and enjoy getting to know ourselves. With raw honesty. It’s scary and painful at times, but it’s worth it because it helps you see more aspects of yourself to let out and you can better assess who would be a better match for you.
Being who we are is always our best bet. The question is do we know who we are right now? It’s a bit philosophical and all, but it’s how I roll lol!
And it’s how I have stopped feeling like “the friend or the fling” kind of girl. I own it now: I get to choose to be a friend, a fling or nothing at all. They don’t.

[lost_hope]

I loved that sentence: “I get to choose to be a friend, a fling or nothing at all” !! There’s a lot of wisdom in that. That’s also something I’m trying to learn: to be the one who decides. But that’s not always easy when you get the attention and intimacy one craves so much. Then a little voice in my head says “this is so scarce, take as much as you can!” and also this thought that “this is as good as it gets anyway”.

When it comes to introspection, I would say I’m something of an expert in that, could also have something to do with studying psychology :D I also happen to have some very good very honest friends with whom I engage in gut-wrenching soulsearching. Which is great it can also be too much, when you always question yourself. But the key is being kind to oneself, as you said ;)

To sum this whole thing up, I guess I just have to accept the fact that finding someone might be harder for me than it is for others but that changing myself is just not worth it because I’m otherwise having a pretty good time :D

(PS: When I was younger I actually thought that getting along well with men would help me find someone. Boy was I wrong!
I also thought that being intellectual and having certain experience would help but I think that only helps guys. I think Miranda from SATC was definitely right with the apartment thing!)

[Angel88]

It is tough. Absolutely. Sometimes it’s hard to stand our ground and say no when we’re not getting what we truly want, but we’re getting something out of it. It’s tricky. But the thoughts of “this is as good as it gets anyway” and “this is so scarce” are the crux of our issues.
Just be, try to be kind to yourself no matter what. It helps. Berating ourselves and thinking everything about us is against us is unrealistic and flat out mean and unhelpful.
We don’t know everything and that’s ok. We simply don’t know what will come. Surrendering and just living one day at a time seems best, at least for me.

[Reds10]

Sometimes it’s hard to stand our ground and say no when we’re not getting what we truly want, but we’re getting something out of it.

Yep. Currently ‘just friends’ with someone I’m very interested in that I met through a work thing, but he has a gf. It’s been a long time since I’ve even had a crush on anyone (long line of bad/boring dates mixed in), so I figured I could settle for friendship. But it’s probably more difficult than not hanging out with him at all.

Angel88, I appreciate your advice of ‘surrendering.’ I think that’s the word I’ve been looking for. It’s been especially hard lately.

[Angel88]

Oh Reds10… That’s not a good place to be. Your sharing about being just friends with someone you’re interested in took me back to the worst experiences I’ve had. They were all “just friends” situationships. Those are traps. You’re not looking for friendship and you know it. Don’t do this to yourself. Walk away. You need your love and kindness more than some consolation price. Deep down we lie to ourselves when we say we’d rather have those men around as friends than not at all, and sometimes we are being dishonest with ourselves and them when we think that if we hang on a little longer, he’ll see how great we are and change his mind or stop caring for whoever they care about who’s not us. Tears rolling down my cheeks by just remembering my hard lessons.
I hope you don’t necessarily go through anything like that, but just be very careful with your precious self.
Isn’t it funny that we go long without liking anyone and just when we do, he’s unavailable?

[Reds10]

Angel88, I really think your reply was the slap in the face I needed. Really. Like Cher slapping Nicolas Cage and yelling ‘snap out of it!’ (except he didn’t snap out of it, but we can isolate that one scene for this purpose). I’m very appreciative of it, although I’m sorry to have brought up not great memories. How I felt a week ago feels foreign now, so it must have worked. This dude sucks, and I also put myself in his girlfriend’s shoes, and I don’t think I’d be ok with my boyfriend paying the same kind of attention to other women as he was to me. I have plenty of male friends who are cognizant of boundaries, and this guy doesn’t seem to be, so his behavior isn’t very respectable either.

Situationships are traps indeed. Thank you again for your post.

[Angel88]

I’m so sorry, Reds10 :(
I didn’t mean to give you a slap in the face as you said, but I did panic when you said you’d rather be his friend than not have him around at all. It was a red flag so huge for me because I’ve said that before and in retrospect, I go “what was I even thinking??” Nobody is that special for us to put our feelings and hearts on the line like that. I am also working on remembering that. Remembering that the only special men are those who choose to love us and who truly see us and want the same level of commitment we want with us. No one else.
For me it still seems like a toll order to find that kind of man, but I don’t want to settle for less than that anymore. What’s the point?
On the bright side I am glad that you are seeing him more clearly now, for who he is, not who you want him to be. I so hear you. I really hope you feel much better about walking away from that and I also hope that you meet someone different who is capable of seeing you and caring about you while you feel the same way for him.

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